duviee71 wrote:

I want to know why we cant play online for free cause some people keep getting disconnected most of the time they could keep everything the same on how it is like you would still have to buy points, addons, movies, etc... but they shouldnt have it where you have to pay to play, how would you feel if you paid for 3 mouths of gold but you only got to play for 4 days because xbox live keeps kicking you off. I would like to hear everyones opinion about this, so please people tell me what you think if they did that for us.

Why do you whine about paying? you are paying right now....
 it wont go free get over it dont wanna pay get a PS3

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Green Day

 duviee71 wrote:

download speed 1684kbps, upload speed 822kbps thats from a server from dallas tx

if you live near dallas im pretty sure you COULD get much better residential service, but then again, the key word is COULD, if you aint willing to spend money to make make sure you got the best you can get on your own end, you cant start accusing other online services for issues. XBL is never down for days at a time, i could prolly count the amount of full day maintenances they've had since i joined in 2007 on just 1 hand.

http://i31.tinypic.com/28j9xkx.png

i live in NJ an pay $60 a month for 30mbps/5mbps, i used your server in Dallas Texas just to prove my point from earlier, that if you're willing to get the best internet service available in your area than you can expect better service while using it.

an seriously, depending on what billing you choose for XBL, $7.99 a month isnt gonna break anyones bank, an if you really think free is better, go read ANY review on www.metacritic.com for PS3 games that have multiplayer, they all get bad marks when it comes to the online aspect from the crossplatform games to even their own exclusive games like SOCOM an MLB The Show, Killzone 2, you name it.

just checked out your ISP website

http://www.embarq.com/Residential/InternetAccess/HighSpeedInternet

an sure enough they offer better packages than the one you're currently using, judging from your speedtest results you're prolly paying for the $34.95 plan right now, an you can clearly see the descriptions of each tier an you 2 below the one that actually mentions ONLINE GAMING, that should tell you something right there, an its only $15 dollars a month more than you paying now, but again it comes back to what matters more to you, if you love gaming online more than any other hobbies then that 15 bucks shouldnt be an issue, but thats up to you.

Maybe you could suggest that instead of Xbox Live membership that runs out even when you're not using it, and input membership that only goes away whenever you are actually connected to xbox live.

 GenuineRoivas wrote:

I also have PS3 (hopefully Xbox mods won't be pissed at me for mentioning that) Which has free on-line. However even though Xbox 360 is not free. It is way better in terms of on-line. You get want you pay for. So $50.00 for a year is a good deal. Sometimes my internet connection craps out, that happens on both consoles during on-line play. I have a shitty internet connection. So it is not the fault of microsoft. If MS were to go free the quality would go down for on-line. It would be nice, not gonna happen. Xbox 360 is the best for on-line. I'll just have to get a bettter connection to the internet. Most times it is good and few major difficulties playing On-line.

I also had a (sony product) and even though it was free to play, its hard to party up in some games and some games are not compatible with the blue tooth headsets or even the wired ones not to mention alot of the things taken for granted on live can not be done at all (partys, streaming moives, chatting across games, profiles, etc) . so fifty bucks a year is not so bad.

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I am a legend, in my own mind.
If u play for fun, then feel free to add me.

www.twitter.com/gilbymartinez

no body is listening to my point of the hourly thing, i have the 3 month gold right now and ive only got to play for 2 weeks so far and ive lost 1 and a half months so far all because my xbox will not connect to xbox live! some of yall say its my equipment and that microsoft has nuthin to do with it, but i can hook up a playstation 3 and play online with no problem. so if i can do that and yall still think it has nuthin to do with microsoft ur crazy!

maybe they should make it 15 cents an hour no more than that, but if they did have hourly my wife would play online, if i could connect online i would only have time to play for a couple of hours a week.

the hourly thing would only run out when ur playing online not just being online. if ur just online it wouldnt run out until u started playin a match in a game.

i was over at one of my buddies house and he has a ps3. i wanted to see if it changed since the last time i was online with one, and it has way beyond 360 dont get me wrong  360 has good games that r fun to play online but ps3 is so bad-a. example their avatar looks better, u can bowl, chat and do other stuff with it without having to buy those addon unlike 360 u have to buy different addons for ur avatar to do stuff like that (***). the ps3 connects so fast when logging on and match making. the ps3 u can play for free but u still have to spend money on stuff like game addons and renting movies just like the 360, they still make alot of money without having to make ppl pay to play so y cant 360. i know a couple years ago they talked about letting ppl play for free but all of a sudden they stopped and know one heard anything about that again! so WTF y cant we play on line for free probly because microsoft needs the money to fix there F**K ups!

Dude I'm sorry, but no one is listening. They have already told you what you need to know. You're idea doesn't make sense fiscally and you need to get a better connection. Alright, close this thread down

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"I went outside once, the graphics weren't that great."

i already have a great connection no xbox wants to connect to it, everything else that i can hook up to internet works just fine!

But if you read my earlier post you'll notice that as the current pricing stands, the current one year Live subscription works out to  13-16 cents a day (depending on the exchange rate).

The only thing I can think of that would solve your concerns is if they came out with say a $30 / year subscription which allowed 10 hours a month or something. But even then, for 30 dollars more it would be a much better deal to have unlimited ability to connect and play. I don't know, there's just no arcade / internet cafe / online game that I can think of that offers unlimited playability for 16 cents a day.

 duviee71 wrote:

maybe they should make it 15 cents an hour no more than that, but if they did have hourly my wife would play online, if i could connect online i would only have time to play for a couple of hours a week.

 Mummys Heroes wrote:

I think it's fair enough for the best and largest gaming community worldwide, but my main reason for not begrudging payin for live is that someone's gotta pay it.
What i mean is ps3 and wii dev's have to pay the server for their online service and this reflects on there game prices . Ie a new ps3 release in an identical game to 360 is usually a fiver more expensive,,, why... cos dev's have to pick up the server bill.
For the sake of having better versions and exclusives of games i am happy to pay the yealry subscription.
i also am against second hand games from game shops. As the devs dont see any of this extra sale cash and this is effecting the gaming industry. Let's be fair we want the best graphics/gameplay available, but they need millions£££ for this. This will ultimatley lead to online only purchasing of games----but not for a long time!!
Support the dev's

PS3-360 releases are priced the same in Canada :(

I have both systems and don't have a problem paying for Live, as it is typically a better service.

Wow.  Dude's just not getting it.  I am a network engineer, and everything these people have told you so far about the issues being with your equipment is totally right.  Vista would not have anything to do with it, unless you were using an internet connection sharing setup in which you actually plugged the xbox into the computer running vista.  I think the speed you are showing should be able to support xbox live.  The typical game only uses about 10-15 KB/s (or 80-120 kb/s) in each direction.  (More if you're hosting).   Example: I just checked my packet flow while playing Gears of War 2 with a full game of people, and it was using 8 KB/s in each direction.

I have had xbox live for a few years now, and I can only think of a few times where xbox live has actually been down.  (On average it's twice a year, and they give you so much advance notice that no one should be surprised)  Any other time there is a problem it is with the equipment of someone I'm playing with, in which case I correct the problem, and we're right back to smooth reliable gaming. 

Another possible issue is that your internet provider could be throttling or even completely closing off xbox live traffic.  Some ISPs have done this because Xbox Live is so popular.  While morally this isn't really a nice thing to do, there's nothing exactly illegal about it either.  But in an effort to preserve their network bandwidth they will slow down or completely cut off traffic running on Xbox Live's ports.  Don't know if your company is one of them, but you may want to give them a call. 

If you really want help in getting your stuff to work, I will help you.  You can email me directly.  alan@nerdinshiningarmor.com.  I will help you the best I can.

If you are just here to bash, then forget about it.

i can only connect an xbox for only 1 month out of a year the other 11 months it will not connect, but i can put a ps3 up to it and it will connect for the whole year.

i've had different internet providers and epuipment and all of them have done the same thang.

Broken record. You are just not listening to anyone. It's getting old and boring now.

 duviee71 wrote:

i was over at one of my buddies house and he has a ps3. i wanted to see if it changed since the last time i was online with one, and it has way beyond 360 dont get me wrong  360 has good games that r fun to play online but ps3 is so bad-a. example their avatar looks better, u can bowl, chat and do other stuff with it without having to buy those addon unlike 360 u have to buy different addons for ur avatar to do stuff like that (***). the ps3 connects so fast when logging on and match making. the ps3 u can play for free but u still have to spend money on stuff like game addons and renting movies just like the 360, they still make alot of money without having to make ppl pay to play so y cant 360. i know a couple years ago they talked about letting ppl play for free but all of a sudden they stopped and know one heard anything about that again! so WTF y cant we play on line for free probly because microsoft needs the money to fix there F**K ups!

What? Currently all updates for 360 avatars are free. With Playstation Home, you have to pay for clothes and you have to pay to furnish your virtual house. Listen to everyone. It's your internet connection.

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hi

dude i been playin xbox for a few years, the only problem ive ever really had was red rings which they gave me a month for the 3 weeks i didnt have it. the only time i never could connect was cuz my crappy internet or their making FREE updates. and ya im sure xbox has lost a couple people playing online because they dont wanna pay but 50 a year is great. i play xbox a LOT. id say minimum 6 hours a day. if it was free you would also have more ***holes playin. u ever tried sayin thanks for the revive in shadowrun on ps3, if not, the reply wasnt too pleasant, actually a more racist response.   point is, if you dont wanna pay 50 a year dats your loss

Hey just checking to see if you got my email.  It came back undeliverable, and I noticed that even though I hit reply it was trying to send to a different email address than yours came from, so I resent it to the address it came from, and no errors yet....

i think they should only count the days that your on. my xbox got the e74 thing and i still had like two months left on membershipand i could not play.

i think it should be free jus bcuz of how many glicthes and maintenence issues most of the games have. jus like now how cod world at war has been messing up lately. and gears of war 2's overmentioned lagggggggggggggggggggggg lol

Mr Shoty Snipes: When I sent my 360 in with an E74 error, I got it back in less than a month, and they gave me a free 1-month gold card with it to make up for that lost time.

 duviee71 wrote:

I want to know why we cant play online for free cause some people keep getting disconnected most of the time they could keep everything the same on how it is like you would still have to buy points, addons, movies, etc... but they shouldnt have it where you have to pay to play, how would you feel if you paid for 3 mouths of gold but you only got to play for 4 days because xbox live keeps kicking you off. I would like to hear everyones opinion about this, so please people tell me what you think if they did that for us.

I will gladly pay $49.99 for a year of XBL, it has more than what we get on PSN for free.People saying playstation online is lag free obviously didnt play madden 09.

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PSN:Cochran88
dont sell your xbox

Just another whiner. Not much of a concrete thought either. We pay around 50 bucks A YEAR. Oh wait, 50 bucks for 13 months. That's even better. But we most certainly don't pay to read posts from people that have no intellectual capability.

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RIP Evan Tanner
DREAM THEATER
Eventus Stoltorum Magister

 YungOneKavon wrote:

i think it should be free jus bcuz of how many glicthes and maintenence issues most of the games have. jus like now how cod world at war has been messing up lately. and gears of war 2's overmentioned lagggggggggggggggggggggg lol

This is because people have gotten lazy and money hungry. Well most. So they pay the creators to rush the product by paying them X amount of dollars. How many updates did Super Mario 2 have to get to make it great? NONE!

Another factor is that games have gotten a lot more complex. But I beleive it is mostly lazyness and rushing of the product instead of carefully crafting it.

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RIP Evan Tanner
DREAM THEATER
Eventus Stoltorum Magister

 CochransLac wrote:

 duviee71 wrote:

I want to know why we cant play online for free cause some people keep getting disconnected most of the time they could keep everything the same on how it is like you would still have to buy points, addons, movies, etc... but they shouldnt have it where you have to pay to play, how would you feel if you paid for 3 mouths of gold but you only got to play for 4 days because xbox live keeps kicking you off. I would like to hear everyones opinion about this, so please people tell me what you think if they did that for us.

I will gladly pay $49.99 for a year of XBL, it has more than what we get on PSN for free.People saying playstation online is lag free obviously didnt play madden 09.

I'm ok with paying my $60 (canadian) for XBL. I guess I have a question to those that have connectivity issues and claim it is either Live or Microsoft's problem. Considering we all sort of connect to the same Live servers, how do explain all our uptime vs your downtime? I'm pretty sure Microsoft / Live don't like my neighborhood more than yours. I'm pretty sure they weren't thinking "well this neighborhood has more teen-30's so we'll make sure they get routed to better servers". I bet if you saw the server room, you'd find that each and every server they have are identical.

And if you read my earlier post, you'll see that at between $50 - $60 a year for Live, it works out to about 16 cents per day.  That's almost free now! Name me another legal service you can get for 16 cents a day.

I think even adopting those Ethiopian kids is something like 30 cents a day?

Anyway that's just my thoughts on the subject!

Yes.  Allow me to set the record straight for everyone who complains about lag and game glitches in regards to xbox live.  The single most important fact to keep in mind is that Microsoft does NOT host games.  Therefore, any issues of lag are directly related to issues with your internet connection, or possibly the connection of the "host" of the game.  If anyone would like to question that I have packet sniffer logs and router connection tables to prove it. 

What MS has done with Xbox Live is created a universal standard for online gaming, so when a developer is making a game for the Xbox they do not have to spend any time writing netcode or implementing their own matchmaking or anything like that.  Therefore the cost of production goes down, and also many more games are able to support online play.  (Look at the number of games out there that support Xbox Live, but do not support any other multi-system features like system link.  This is because they can implement Xbox Live play for basically nothing, but would have to pay someone to program code to run in system link)  Now the exception to this case is EA, who has insisted on running their own servers for the Battlefield games (and maybe others).  They still rely on Xbox Live for everything else, but the gameplay itself is run from their servers rather than directly hosted by a player.  Anyone who bought Battlefield 1943 at launch knows this, as EA dropped the ball on having enough servers ready, and people couldn't play.

So, where does Microsoft come into the picture you ask?  Microsoft's servers handle pretty much everything else related to the service.  Everytime you play a game the Microsoft servers keep track of all the stats related to the game.  This information is used for skill-based matchmaking.  If anyone doubts how much effort goes into this, go to google and look up the trueskill formula.  I took advanced calculus classes (and passed them) and this stuff still made me want to curl up in a ball, rock back and forth, and cry.

Whenever you play an online game the process looks something like this:  1. Your game talks to the Microsoft servers to say that it wants to play.  2.  Based on your skill level it pairs you up with other people to play with.  3. A host is selected 4.  The ip address of all the players is sent to each console, connections are made, and the game goes forth.  (The process is much more complicated than that, I just simplified it enough to still be able to make my point.  Feel free to ask me for any details you like.)

Also, Microsoft hosts the information needed for the party system, though those connections are still made directly.  This is why it is a gold member only perk.  Microsoft also hosts the marketplace listings.  (The content itself is hosted by a company called Limelight Networks, though Microsoft pays them to handle it, so it would be fair to say that Microsoft hosts the content)

Anyways, this post has ended up being way longer than I wanted it to be.  And before anyone asks, no, I do not work for Microsoft, nor have I ever.  I just am a person that likes to know things.  I also hate to see people engaging in ignorant finger pointing. 

So the point of my post is, if you have lag, IT'S YOUR PROBLEM!  (or possibly the problem of the host, though the matchmaking system does also pair based on ping times, so if someone had a crappy connection, it would be highly unlikely that they get picked as host)

In closing, I have no problem paying for live, and as many others have said, I also have no problem with live.  I am on it quite a bit, and the only time I ever have any problems is on scheduled maintenance days, which are very rare (usually twice a year or so).  We often blame the internet connection for being crappy, but actually it's usually the router or other people on your connection hosing it up.  Learn a little bit about your router.  It can make a world of difference.  Just a few performance tweaks on a typical router can be life-changing.

I love giving adivce (if you haven't figured that out already, so if anyone would like router help or advice, feel free to PM me or even email me directly.  alan@nerdinshiningarmor.com 

On timers means you cant just sit around though because you're burning the time. Lets just say we try and get your connection fixed, that would resolve the issue. Something must be wrong if you cannot be connected to live all the time like the rest of us. I don't mind the bill when you compare it to all the things we get for it.

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Winning is the only option, even a draw is considered as a defeat.

Runnin'n'Gunnin

I just wanted to say that this guy has provided me with about 5 minutes of enjoyment for the week.  I don't care if he's trolling or is really that close minded and moronic, but it's great.  Thinking DSL and an old router running at "downlaod speed 1684kbps, upload speed 822kbps thats from a server from dallas tx" is good is just plain stupid.  Decent would be about 6mbit and good would be 30+.    Also, xbox only disconnects for you and your friends, hardcore gamers play 50 hours+ a week.